#jython IRC Log (v0.9)

Index

IRC Log for 2011-04-13

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

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[11:28] <Raydiation> is there any bonus from running python on the jvm? is it faster?
[11:31] <Raydiation> or is it just for getting the java libs?
[11:34] <Raydiation> plus could it run on dalvik?
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[13:27] <agronholm> Raydiation: no GIL, and access to java libs
[13:28] <agronholm> not faster though, at least not atm
[13:29] <Raydiation> agronholm: that means proper multicore usage?
[13:30] <agronholm> something like that, yes
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[14:52] <jimbaker> we should take a look at the new impl of ConcurrentHashMap that doug lea just released - this is a big bottleneck for jython
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[17:45] <jimbaker> shashank, did you see the news on the concurrency -interest list (http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.java.jsr.166-concurrency/7798) re ConcurrentHashMap improvements?
[17:45] <jimbaker> definitely something we could try out on gradual.colorado.edu
[17:46] <jimbaker> it also potentially could reduce the pressure on the work to map python objects to real java objects (but that work should be done anyway, it will still improve things)
[17:47] <jimbaker> one interesting thing is whether we could also look at readjusting the initial concurrency settings so it doesn't favor read so much
[17:48] <jimbaker> (as in multiple readers, 1 writer, as it is now)
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[17:58] <pjenvey> jimbaker - yea, totally
[18:00] <jimbaker> pjenvey, sys.getsizeof({}) says 280 bytes for both python 2.6 and 2.7. maybe even better
[18:00] <jimbaker> (cpython of course)
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[20:38] * benallard (~benallard@82-171-74-132.ip.telfort.nl) has joined #jython
[20:38] <benallard> Hi there !
[20:39] <benallard> I'd like some enlightment / pointer to doc about some properties of jython
[20:39] <benallard> Am I at the right place ?
[20:40] <benallard> Let me try ...
[20:40] <benallard> Some of you might already have heard about javacards
[20:41] <benallard> Those are smartcards running a //special// Java VM
[20:41] <benallard> The file format we put on those javacards is called CAP file
[20:42] <benallard> basically, this is class file with a lot of pretreatment done:
[20:42] <benallard> pre-linked, ...
[20:44] <benallard> Right now, I'm successful in parsing those CAP file, and I'm in the process to literally transcode the javacard VM bytecode to Python bytecode.
[20:45] <benallard> This is a hard task: lot of bytecode have no exact correspondance, the linking has to be de-obfuscated, ...
[20:45] <benallard> I was wondering if jython could be of some help to me !
[20:46] <benallard> ... and I thought ... why not ask on IRC ?
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[21:36] <benallard> Ok, it's pretty quiet over there ... :(
[21:37] <benallard> Could someone at least direct me to the best ML for that question ? I don't really know if it's more usr or dev related ...
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[22:02] <benallard> I'll be reading the logs, so don't worry about posting in my absence.
[22:16] <pjenvey> benallard - why are you translating this bytecode into python bytecode
[22:18] <pjenvey> i don't think jython would help with this task, we generally go the other way around, compiling to jvm bytecodes
[22:24] * yekinabud (~tony@fsf/member/yekinabud) has joined #jython
[22:26] <yekinabud> can someone help me understand why my postgres jdbc driver only loads when i add the path to the jar via jython -J-cp MYCLASSPATH rather than from within my script with sys.path.append(MYCLASSPATH)?
[22:34] <pjenvey> yekinabud - not sure, we have tests for that. maybe try running jython -v (for verbose import statements)
[22:34] <pjenvey> assuming MYCLASSPATH is a path to a jar file, anyway
[22:34] <pjenvey> an individual path
[22:36] <yekinabud> pjenvey: yes, it's a path that works like jython -J-cp '/lib/postgresql-jdbc.jar'
[22:36] <yekinabud> i'll try -v and see what happens
[22:45] <yekinabud> pjenvey: using jython -v doesn't seem to tell me what's happening with the jars either way
[22:48] <yekinabud> i should probably simplify my script and isolate the issue - but just wanted to check if there were some obvious issues about adding class paths via sys.path.append() at run time
[22:48] <pjenvey> yekinabud - ok. FYI our test for this is https://fisheye3.atlassian.com/browse/jython/branches/Release_2_5maint/jython/Lib/test/test_classpathimporter.py?r=HEAD I believe
[22:50] <yekinabud> ah, cool, thanks pjenvey - i'll take a look and try to figure out how that will help diagnose my problem
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[23:12] <CarlFK> how do I install pip?
[23:17] <pjenvey> CarlFK - same way you would on cpython
[23:17] <CarlFK> um, I use apt-get
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[23:18] <pjenvey> CarlFK - ooh, ok then, follow pip's installation instructions and you should be good
[23:19] <agronholm_> CarlFK: https://github.com/pypa/pip/raw/master/contrib/get-pip.py
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[23:46] <CarlFK> agronholm_: that's nice too. kinda untrusted binary like. or at least it would be a pain to look at it's source
[23:47] <agronholm_> CarlFK: if you don't trust pip, don't install it
[23:48] <agronholm_> you could always manually decode this and inspect it yourself
[23:48] <CarlFK> that would be the pain part
[23:49] <agronholm_> why bother then
[23:49] <CarlFK> to see what it is doing
[23:49] <agronholm_> it installs pip
[23:50] <CarlFK> that isn't easily determined
[23:50] <agronholm_> you are saying that I might be lying, or that the authors of pip might be spreading malware?
[23:50] <CarlFK> "read on IRC" isn't the same as "read the code"
[23:51] <CarlFK> lying implies intent or something. those are figthing words
[23:51] <agronholm_> then what are you implying?
[23:51] <CarlFK> if I tell someone "it installs pip" and you are wrong, am I lying ?
[23:52] <CarlFK> I am implying it isn't a trusted source
[23:52] <agronholm_> that is the official git repository of pip
[23:52] <agronholm_> if you don't trust them, maybe you shouldn't install pip at all
[23:53] <agronholm_> so in what way is that an untrusted source?
[23:53] <CarlFK> actually the whole pipy thing is kinda scary
[23:53] <agronholm_> how so
[23:54] <CarlFK> the may have to wait.. im on the other line ;)

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These logs were automatically created by JythonLogBot_ on irc.freenode.net using a slightly modified version of the Java IRC LogBot (github).