#jython IRC Log (v0.9)

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IRC Log for 2012-06-25

Timestamps are in GMT/BST.

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[5:57] <int3__> does weakref work on new-style objects?
[5:58] <int3__> i saw a test with a comment saying otherwise, but i'm not sure if it's up-to-date
[6:27] <int3__> hm, seems to work for set(), at least. no idea why the itertools classes i'm working with don't have that behavior :/
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[16:42] <iaindalton> What's the best way to include a bunch of jars (that are in the same directory) in my path? Specifying JYTHONPATH=/path/to/dir/ doesn't work.
[16:43] <agronholm> CLASSPATH=/path/to/dir/*
[16:43] <agronholm> provided you're on JRE6 or later
[16:46] <iaindalton> that did it
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[17:08] * ingenieroariel (c0566423@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.86.100.35) has joined #jython
[17:09] <ingenieroariel> Hello all, I just tried to download jython from jython.org but the website is not accessible
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[17:09] <ingenieroariel> is this a known issue?
[17:09] * ingenieroariel is looking at the link on top for jython 2.7a
[17:11] <iaindalton> The site was up on Friday. BTW, that topic is out of date; 2.7a2 is the latest version.
[17:12] <agronholm> ingenieroariel: seems to work fine for me, what particular link was not working?
[17:13] <iaindalton> agronholm: http://www.jython.org/ gives a 404
[17:13] <tcrawley> jython.org works, www.jython.org does not
[17:13] <iaindalton> Right
[17:13] <agronholm> seems that way
[17:13] <iaindalton> A few days ago, the www subdomain worked.
[17:13] <ingenieroariel> oh, I get it now
[17:13] <iaindalton> Cool URIs don't change. http://www.w3.org/Provider/Style/URI
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[17:15] <ingenieroariel> should I help filing a bug report about it? or are there any of the project leads reading this now?
[17:16] <ingenieroariel> The bug tracker does not have any css :/ http://bugs.jython.org/
[17:16] <ingenieroariel> it is being affected by the same issue :)
[17:17] <agronholm> juneau001: ping
[17:32] <ingenieroariel> I am taking off, thanks tcrawley for the link and agronholm for your help
[17:33] <ingenieroariel> *and iaindalton
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[17:52] <juneau001> agronholm: that may be something that fwierzbicki can help with, or possibly the python.org crew
[17:52] <agronholm> ah
[17:52] <agronholm> I don't know who to contact
[17:54] <juneau001> hmm, I can send an email to the person that helps me out with python.org
[17:54] <juneau001> I will see what he has to say
[17:54] <agronholm> that should work
[17:57] <juneau001> fwierzbicki may have the keys to that domain name though, I will try to contact him also
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[19:10] <slestak_work> devs aware jython.org is down?
[19:10] <pjenvey> it works for me
[19:11] <slestak_work> bugs.jython.org is up, but www.jython.org 404's for me. Apache/2.2.22 (Ubuntu) Server at www.jython.org Port 80
[19:11] <tcrawley> we went over this a bit earlier - jython.org works, www.jython.org does not
[19:11] <slestak_work> interesting. didnt notice that until now.
[19:11] <tcrawley> juneau001 was going to see if he could find someone to fix it
[19:12] <slestak_work> i think the reason I noticed it today is Chrome keeps prepending www. even when I am not typing it
[19:13] <slestak_work> ok, when i enter http://jython.org im in. the topic here needs to be updated for alpha2 also
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[19:36] <juneau001> I have sent emails regarding www.jython.org???a domain mapping issue, I presume. Have not received any responses as yet???we'll get it sorted asap though.
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[20:40] <juneau001> DNS has been repaired, changes may take up to 24 hours to propagate.
[20:43] <agronholm> that long??
[20:43] <agronholm> that's an insane TTL
[20:44] <agronholm> someone deserves a good whipping
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[20:47] <iaindalton> What is the size limit over which Jython reports that the method size is too large?
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[20:53] <agronholm> not sure, but if you hit that limit you should fix your code
[20:54] <Arfrever> iaindalton: Have you reproduced issue #1891?
[21:01] <iaindalton> indeed I have, with Pygments no less ;-)
[21:01] <Arfrever> iaindalton: I also reproduced this regression with chardet.
[21:03] <pjenvey> iaindalton - i think that size is on the bug tracker issue for that
[21:04] <juneau001> yeah, not sure why it will take that long to propagate???for some reason the www.jython.org was pointed to wiki.jython.org..not sure why that was the case. However, wiki.jython.org was recently moved to a different machine, so that is why www.jython.org was broken. DNS has been updated accordingly to resolve the issue, once it propagates.
[21:05] <iaindalton> pjenvey: no, I don't see a size mentioned
[21:06] <iaindalton> There must be a way to install pdb++ without pulling in Pygments :-P
[21:06] <pjenvey> http://bugs.jython.org/issue527524
[21:06] <pjenvey> "Code of
[21:06] <pjenvey> a method longer than 65535 bytes"
[21:07] <pjenvey> http://stackoverflow.com/a/5689834
[21:09] <iaindalton> pjenvey: ah, thanks. I only looked at #1891
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[22:07] <fwierzbicki> juneau001: thanks for figuring that out
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[23:03] <jimbaker`> fwiw, long string constants should just work - there's special support in the compiler that can construct such long strings
[23:04] <jimbaker`> long methods are another problem. pycimport is one workaround. it's not a good one
[23:08] <Arfrever> Why some long methods work in Jython 2.5 and do not work in Jython 2.7?
[23:12] <jimbaker`> Arfrever, without specifics, i will just have to guess that 2.7 compiles differently, given the use of asm 4 and other changes
[23:12] <jimbaker`> Arfrever, i don't believe anyone has looked into this detail however
[23:13] <Arfrever> jimbaker`: Where is limit of method size hardcoded?
[23:14] <jimbaker`> Arfrever, we delegate that task to asm, only when it serializes java bytecode would that be knowable
[23:14] <jimbaker`> and at all useful
[23:15] <jimbaker`> when someone (maybe me, but...) gets around to writing the python bytecode compiler, other limits can then apply
[23:15] <Arfrever> jimbaker`: Is current limit somewhere in asm or JDK?
[23:19] <jimbaker`> Arfrever, it is a limitation of the classfile format
[23:20] <jimbaker`> Arfrever, asm builds classfiles for us, so it's determined at that point
[23:20] <jimbaker`> in particular the JVM defines offsets as 16 signed bits
[23:21] <jimbaker`> Arfrever, in general, we never see this. we work with asm through labels and other abstractions. but at some point, serialization to a class occurs
[23:22] <codedivine> Hi. I am wondering if anyone has looked at porting Jython to Android
[23:22] <codedivine> I also emailed on the jython-users list btw (rahul here) :)
[23:23] <jimbaker`> codedivine, i have looked
[23:24] <jimbaker`> it is definitely doable, and i have some presentations around that talk about this
[23:24] <codedivine> cool!
[23:24] <codedivine> very interested in that. any links you can give me?
[23:24] <jimbaker`> codedivine, the python bytecode compiler is a key piece. but if you restrict your code to ahead-of-time compilation, that's not necessary
[23:25] <jimbaker`> codedivine, i'm very sloppy about this. i guess i would refer to one of my presentations on pyvideo.org
[23:26] <jimbaker`> i believe the last one there talks about it. anyway, although this is doable, it's not simple
[23:26] <codedivine> ok will check out :)
[23:27] <codedivine> ok i am checking, looks like you gave a talk at PyCon 2012
[23:28] <jimbaker`> shashank has been working on a restructuring of the compiler that manages the control flow graph. when he fixes one last bug (or two! always like this), this will be a great starting point
[23:28] <jimbaker`> we will have enough info to serialize to python bytecode too
[23:29] <codedivine> would look into it and get back :)
[23:29] <jimbaker`> the other key part is to ensure that proxy classes are also compiled ahead of time. or use dynamic proxies, but that's restricted to interfaces on the JVM
[23:30] <codedivine> i am writing some numeric Android libs that I would very much like to expose as some numpy-like library to Jython
[23:31] <codedivine> so wondering, is the problem that Jython is generating JVM byteocde?
[23:32] <codedivine> so thats my motivation
[23:33] <codedivine> i think i will look and learn more and then get back :)
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[23:33] <codedivine> thanks for all your help Jim!
[23:36] <codedivine> whereas android uses dex?
[23:38] <codedivine> or am i completely missing the point :)?
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