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[0:31] <jimbaker> i've been talking with some of the ubuntu developers (aka friends) about getting a debian package together for jython. any objections/concerns about my looking at gaining ownership of the jython debian package?
[0:31] <jimbaker> it's currently stuck on 2.1
[0:32] <Oti> jim - no absolutely no objections!
[0:32] <Oti> would be great if we knew how to to this
[0:32] <jimbaker> sorry, 2.2.1 - same difference for me:)
[0:33] <jimbaker> sounds good. i'll approach the current maintainer and see where to take this
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[1:05] <pr3d4t0r> :: yawn ::
[1:30] <jimbaker> pr3d4t0r: what's up?
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[7:45] <pr3d4t0r> pjenvey!
[7:47] <pr3d4t0r> pjenvey: If you see this: what are the plans for a Jython 2.5.2 or later release? I'm about to suggest to someone that they download the 2.5.x stable for an open source project. 2.5.1 still has that binding bug.
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[11:13] <Asmageddon> Hi, guys
[11:13] <Asmageddon> Anybody present here?
[11:23] <Asmageddon> I'm going afk, but I'll be gratefull if somebody explains how should I compose my python file so it compiles with jython, and how to make it work with java runtime(javaws, or what it was). Shall I pack it into *.jar file? I use linux and have got Jython 2.2.1 on java1.6.0_20. Also - does jython support pygame?
[11:27] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: 1. Just write it in Python, as always.
[11:28] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: 2. Put it in a .jar, and define modules/packages accordingly.
[11:28] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Don't forget to add __init__.py to your package directories before you .jar them or Jython may not see them.
[11:29] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: 3. Yes, you may pack them in a .jar (see 2).
[11:30] <pr3d4t0r> Z z .
[11:31] <Asmageddon> what do you mean by define modules/packages ?
[11:31] <Asmageddon> I'm not really that experienced in python
[11:32] <Asmageddon> so you mean that I should write all the .py files normally, put them into a jar and execute with jython?
[11:34] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: a) Python modules ~= Java packages.
[11:36] <Asmageddon> And does jython support pygame?
[11:36] <Asmageddon> I mean - can I compile pygame game with jython?
[11:37] <Asmageddon> also one more thing - how much(if at all) are java programs compiled with jython faster than normal python?
[11:37] <Asmageddon> As I don't know if it is worthy compiling them at all....
[11:37] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Yes, write your Python code as usual, then put it in a .jar.
[11:38] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: If you run it in your file system first, your compiled PyJava .class files will be auto-generated. You can make your .jar with those too.
[11:38] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: No real performance advantage doing that.
[11:38] <Asmageddon> Ah
[11:38] <Asmageddon> So I wont be doing that
[11:38] <Asmageddon> Ok, thanks for all the help
[11:38] <pr3d4t0r> c) I don't know what pygame is. If it has native code/non-Python calls, it won't work.
[11:39] <Asmageddon> However - I may later rewrite this game in java and then use some jython for name generator and other things
[11:39] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: d) Programs compiled with Jython are as slow or equivalent to regular Python, and in many cases slower (pure computation).
[11:39] <Asmageddon> Ah, I hoped that jython does optimise the code so it runs as fast as java does....
[11:40] <Asmageddon> hmmm, can I use jython to run java modules from inside python?
[11:40] <Asmageddon> I could use that for faster generation of perlin noise
[11:40] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: You may use Java --> Python and backward if you run your code in the Jython run-time.
[11:41] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: HOWEVER - please don't do that too much. It's stupid for two reasons.
[11:41] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: 1. Python and Java both have excellent libraries; if you code in Python, use the Python classes/objects. Ditto for Java. You add unnecessary compatibility issues and complexity by criss-crossing them.
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[11:42] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: 2. Mixing and matching Jython vs. Java creates class loader issues that may eventually hose your app. Ditto for GC.
[11:43] <Asmageddon> Mhm
[11:43] <Asmageddon> And also one more thing - is it possible to use external C/C++ compiled libraries in python?
[11:43] <Asmageddon> I really could use faster generation of perlin noise....
[11:43] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Python - yes. It was designed for that.
[11:44] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Jython - expect JNI tap dancing.
[11:44] <Asmageddon> How can I do that?
[11:44] <Asmageddon> what is JNI tap dancing? ^^'
[11:44] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: JNI == Java Native Interface.
[11:44] <Asmageddon> And how can I use external C/C++ modules in python?
[11:44] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: An extra layer of crap that you need to involve in running native code from a Python program running in a Jython run-time on a JVM.
[11:44] <Asmageddon> shall I compile them into .so .dll or something?
[11:45] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Compile what?
[11:45] <Asmageddon> the C/C++ code
[11:46] <Asmageddon> so I can use it as a module in python
[11:49] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Yeah. Go google JNI for Java and check this out: http://docs.python.org/extending/extending.html
[11:49] <Asmageddon> Nah, I don't want to use java/jython right now, that is purely python question
[11:49] <Asmageddon> ahh, it is python docs, ok, sorry
[11:49] * pr3d4t0r smacks Asmageddon.
[11:49] * Asmageddon dies
[11:52] <Asmageddon> Is there any short version of this tutorial?
[11:52] <Asmageddon> ^^
[11:53] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: That's the simplest one out there.
[11:53] <Asmageddon> Well, guess I'll have to read it whole
[11:53] <Asmageddon> I can still consider myself lucky - I even wrote a game with procedurally generated infinite world without reading a single tutorial
[11:54] <Asmageddon> nor C/C++, nor python one
[11:57] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: You're in the wrong business if you don't like to read.
[11:57] <Asmageddon> It's the opposite - I love to read
[11:58] <Asmageddon> However english is not my native language and I sometimes have a bit of trouble with specialistic tutorials
[11:58] <Asmageddon> Not that I don't get it, but the reading is a bit slower
[11:58] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Heh.
[11:58] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Where in Poland?
[11:58] <Asmageddon> I prefer when somebody explains only as much as neccesary with simple english
[11:58] <Asmageddon> did you check my ip? :p
[11:58] <Asmageddon> yes
[11:59] <Asmageddon> Ahh, you mean what city?
[11:59] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Yes
[11:59] <Asmageddon> I live in a small village near Radom
[11:59] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Ah.
[11:59] <Asmageddon> It's called Augustów
[11:59] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: I was there 3 weeks ago, in Poznan.
[11:59] <Asmageddon> Right next to Młodocin Mniejszy
[11:59] <Asmageddon> And how it was?
[12:00] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Awezome.
[12:00] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: :)
[12:00] <Asmageddon> Really?
[12:00] <Asmageddon> And where do you live?
[12:00] <Asmageddon> heh, I guess that any kind of travel is kind of awesome. Unless it's your 100th time :p
[12:01] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: San Francisco.
[12:01] <Asmageddon> So you live in usa?
[12:01] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: I was in Dublin last week.
[12:01] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: About half of the time :)
[12:02] <Asmageddon> Ahh, Dublin lies in poland, right?
[12:02] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Heh - no.
[12:02] <Asmageddon> or is it german city?
[12:02] <Asmageddon> Well, sounds polish (a bit):p
[12:02] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: I go to Europe, on average, once/week for about 8 months of the year.
[12:02] <Asmageddon> Why so?
[12:02] <pr3d4t0r> Er, once/month
[12:02] <Asmageddon> Doesn't plane flight cost quite much?
[12:04] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Yeah, a bit.
[12:05] <Asmageddon> So why do you fly to europe so often?
[12:05] <Asmageddon> Is it for bussines?
[12:05] <Asmageddon> or just for fun?
[12:06] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: Yes ;)
[12:06] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: I'm going to bed. It's 0300 here.
[12:06] <Asmageddon> Yes, for fun, or yes for bussines?
[12:07] <Asmageddon> ok, good night, for me it's 12:06, so it feels strange to say it :p
[12:07] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: "Yes" <-- both ;)
[12:07] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: http://eugeneciurana.com/galereya/view_album.php?set_albumName=Berlin2010 - 4 weeks ago.
[12:07] <pr3d4t0r> Asmageddon: http://eugeneciurana.com/galereya/view_album.php?set_albumName=GeeCON2010 - 3 weeks ago.
[12:08] <Asmageddon> no idea why, but that phot of monitor reminded me of ReactOS :p
[12:08] <Asmageddon> which being clone of Windows NT - upholded tradition, and crashed while installing on vbox :>
[12:09] <pr3d4t0r> Heh.
[12:09] <pr3d4t0r> Good nite!
[12:10] <Asmageddon> Good night :p
[12:10] <Asmageddon> In polish, "dobranoc!"
[12:11] <Asmageddon> http://www.ivona.com/?tk=yuCM0Hk3
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